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| Louth Peregrines - disappointing news http://www.lbcarchive.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=11656 |
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| Author: | Alan Ball [ Tue Feb 02, 2010 2:51 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Louth Peregrines - disappointing news |
We are informed that the Church counsel met last night to discuss the implications of having Peregrines nesting on the walkway around the tower and decided that they no longer want to encourage Peregrines to nest, which would result in having to stop public access to all of the walkway. Whilst this is disappointing news for us and all birdwatchers, we have to respect the church's decision that has to cater for the wider public and all points of view. Hopefully the two birds, that now seem to have paired up, will find somewhere suitable to nest eleswhere in Louth. Alan |
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| Author: | John Clarkson [ Tue Feb 02, 2010 5:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Louth Peregrines - disappointing news |
This is very disappointing news and I have already received several messages expressing regret at this decision. The church would lose some money as the tower would have to be closed until the end of July, probably; the income from sightseers is about £1200 pa I have been told. However, much of this would probably be earned during the August holidays and some of this would doubtless be compensated by Peregrine watchers. I don't think we have to respect the church's decision but there's probably not much that we can do about it. They have to, as Alan says, cater for a wider public and all points of view but I don't think all points of view have been represented in this argument, certainly not by the locals. Those that I have spoken to have been outraged and it is for this reason that I have spoken to the editor of the Louth Leader who is very interested to hear what the people of Louth think. But this is not just a Louth matter and I'm sure that all birders would regret this decision. John |
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| Author: | Phil Espin [ Tue Feb 02, 2010 8:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Louth Peregrines - disappointing news |
Indeed this is most disappointing and I'm not sure why we should respect the decision and not attempt to bring more pressure to bear when its not clear exactly who has taken the decision and what degree of local consultation took place in reaching it. I'm sure most locals would be quite upset by deliberately stopping Peregrines breed which we will no doubt see when its blown all over the papers. The Lincoln diocese website has the following document concerning bats: http://www.lincoln.anglican.org/pdf_view.php?id=326 (may have to cut and paste) which makes it clear that they are happy to use the legal protection afforded to bats to pursue those stealing lead from church roofs. Bats seem to have more protection than Peregrines in this regard. Its a criminal offence to disturb them all year while for Peregrines it seems only when they've laid eggs does the protection kicks in. Perhaps we should be checking on the bat use of the tower which, if bats are present in it, might impact people walking up it and give the Peregrines a chance. The tower doesn't open to the public until Easter Monday according to the church website. Radcliffe's book "The Peregrine" states the first egg laying date is around the first week of April, so it is possible the birds may have eggs before the tower is open to the public. So will someone be up there specifically trying to stop them nesting? I personally can't see the legal difference between deliberately preventing them from breeding and destroying a nest, the result of both is no reproduction, certainly there is no moral difference. I doubt whether they will use an alternative site having selected the church tower. The disused malt kiln looks as if it ought to be a possible nesting site but despite looking I've never seen them on it. If they get put off in April it may be too late for them to try again even if they do select another site. Alan have they said to whom objections should be addressed? or should we scatter them from the Archbishop of Canterbury downward? |
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| Author: | John Lusby [ Tue Feb 02, 2010 11:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Louth Peregrines - disappointing news |
ive been getting emails from all diff people today about this at the church i and the other birds in louth is knot happy whats going on .the papers said they will do some thing to help ive we need them .the lincs wild life trust maybe to help as if we need to as well .the church wants use to go every sunday i think this is bad on there part , lets try our best to get the birds to nest in the church im will to pay some money out if we need to to stop them takeing the nest site out. john lusby |
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| Author: | Michael Surr [ Wed Feb 03, 2010 12:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Louth Peregrines - disappointing news |
Just some thoughts on the matter, there can be no reason at all why local people and the media can pass opinions, if need be going against the church council and making them rethink the issue. After all even the condemned man is allowed an appeal Again, in the end this issue is down to one thing, MONEY I also believe the church could also gain from the publicity it would receive, am sure Lincoln Cathedral does. Regards Mike Surr |
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| Author: | Rick Bennett [ Wed Feb 03, 2010 5:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Louth Peregrines - disappointing news |
I entirely agree with Phil. The more bad publicity the church attracts the better. If they intended to dissuade them from nesting then it was immoral of them not to do so earlier before they had bonded with the place as well as each other. There is little chance they could relocate at this stage. They have therefore effectively been prevented from breeding. I thought that those breeding birds rare enough to be afforded protection were entitled to be left undisturbed at their nest site which this surely is. Rick |
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| Author: | Alan Ball [ Thu Feb 04, 2010 11:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Louth Peregrines - disappointing news |
It would appear we are not alone; see.......... http://news.scotsman.com/nature/Falcons ... 6021062.jp Alan |
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| Author: | Graham Catley [ Thu Feb 04, 2010 7:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Louth Peregrines - disappointing news |
Not sure where the idea comes from that Schedule 1 species are only protected when they have eggs? Deliberate disturbance of Sched 1 species at a breeding site is still an offense as far as I know and destroying a nest site is similarly so -- so they may be on a very sticky wicket -- not knowing the site well is there not an alternative spot where a nest box or platform could be put in anticipation? |
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| Author: | Paul French [ Thu Feb 04, 2010 8:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Louth Peregrines - disappointing news |
Graham Catley wrote: Not sure where the idea comes from that Schedule 1 species are only protected when they have eggs? Deliberate disturbance of Sched 1 species at a breeding site is still an offense as far as I know and destroying a nest site is similarly so -- so they may be on a very sticky wicket -- not knowing the site well is there not an alternative spot where a nest box or platform could be put in anticipation? I was thinking exactly that. Peregrines use a traditional nest site, and it's an offence to disturb them "at or near the nest". I would imagine that this could be interpreted to mean the nest site all year round. Be a good test case at the very least. |
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| Author: | Rick Bennett [ Thu Feb 04, 2010 10:30 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Louth Peregrines - disappointing news |
So several of us believe that the church may be breaking the law if they prevent the peregrines from nesting on their premises. It would seem appropriate that a few of us let them know and I will do so. It is not without precident that householders suffer financially because the presence of bats prevents them from carrying out modifications to their property. I see no reason why the church should be allowed to ignore the same law for financial reasons. Lincoln cathedral have cooperated with the RSPB and seem to be quite happy to have peregrines on their premises. They would seem to be a higher authority. Cheers. Rick |
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| Author: | Phil Espin [ Sat Feb 06, 2010 12:31 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Louth Peregrines - disappointing news |
It would be hard to say this is a traditional nest site because Peregrines haven't nested on Louth Church, in the last 50 years at least, who knows if they ever have before? When does a man provided nesting platform that hasn't been used yet, become a nest site? I'm not sure on the disturbance point before they start actually nesting. Perhaps someone who knows the law, Nige Lound for instance could comment on that point. From the ground it looks more like a nest box approached through a gap in the masonry parapet rather than a platform. I don't know if they intend to remove this box but its still there today. Whether the birds will attempt to nest without the box and before the tower is opened up on Easter Monday will be interesting to see. |
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| Author: | Geoff Mullett [ Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:37 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Louth Peregrines - disappointing news |
It's not a box, but a flat tray (I think with some sand/gravel on it), placed a little above the walkway on the north side of the tower. From my viewpoint on the ground the other morning, both birds appeared to land on it after circling the church for some minutes. Geoff |
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