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 Post subject: Re: HIDDEN HIDES
PostPosted: Sat Jul 27, 2013 11:57 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jul 11, 2013 10:55 pm
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Location: Saltfleetby
Stuart,
I was not questioning for one moment your integrity as a responsible ringer but a little managing of the habitat is neither here nor there if birds are not directly affected.
Mike


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 Post subject: Re: HIDDEN HIDES
PostPosted: Sun Jul 28, 2013 9:32 am 
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I fully agree re the management, Mike - it's the timing that is important.
Regards, Stuart


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 Post subject: Re: HIDDEN HIDES
PostPosted: Sun Jul 28, 2013 5:09 pm 
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Location: Tetney Marshes or Idle Valley Notts.
Andy Sharp wrote:
We had a hide hidden really well the other week. I was truly impressed at the lengths that our summer visitors go to to express their curiosity <snip> burning them to the ground, smashing them up for camp fires, daubing them with crude suggestions, toilet deposits, sex, booze ups, litter bins and climbing frames are all pastimes <snip>

Hides. A constant source of amusement.


Christ! I know the building of the Humber bridge must have isolated Barton a little but don't you have a police force Andy?

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 Post subject: Re: HIDDEN HIDES
PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2013 12:16 am 
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Location: Tetney Marshes or Idle Valley Notts.
Graham Catley wrote:
there has been a phenomenal growth of vegetation this year with reeds maybe up to 1m higher than normal and it is very easy for hides to disappear and the view to go from them if not managed. Unfortunately I feel the problem is that managing the view from the hide is a second thought when it becomes obscured and then if the reeds are high enough there may be reed warblers nesting in them but if things were kept cut and low from the start of the spring growing season and trimmed every few weeks it would be much easier to keep on top of things and nothing would be nesting in the vegetation. <snip>


Sounds so simple when put like that Graham. Yet many reserves I visit suffer similar problems of miss management year on year and not just in Linc's either.
At my local SSSI in Nottinghamshire. We only have 2 hides both in a small wood and both without seating and used by no one, as far as I am aware.
The first hide is sited at a feeding station, with no feeders. :roll:
While the second is often used as an Owl roost, as the view for visitors is blocked by vegetation. :(

The other viewpoints here. Have viewing screens with some in need of having 5 feet tall vegetation cut down in front of them to enable visitors to look through the viewing slots.
Others are in dire need of repair, some having been badly constructed, or have had timbers removed, leaving the slots almost 10 feet wide by 3 foot deep. So as you approach the screen everything fly's off. =D>

Despite £1,000,000 of lottery funding it would appear that hides, screens and visitor viewing facilities are even less than a second thought here. [-X

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 Post subject: Re: HIDDEN HIDES
PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2013 2:09 pm 
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Location: Cleethorpes
Hide design also needs updating to take into consideration today's big lenses. A lens hood for the Canon 500f4 is 6.5 inches in diameter, it doesn't fit through the slot of some hides and those it does it is very restricting movement-wise.
Someone with knowledge of bird watchers and bird photographers needs to revisit these hides with a carpenter's tool box, especially a saw or are we going to have to organise that ourselves too?


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 Post subject: Re: HIDDEN HIDES
PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:03 pm 
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Very true Colin some hides the designs are awful, and very expensive . And Gilleard Bros Ltd Bird Hides , need to learn how to keep the water out of them ? the one at toft water leaks in all over the place, which for the money it cost is shocking ... :evil:

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 Post subject: Re: HIDDEN HIDES
PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2013 9:02 pm 
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Looking back at all the comments it looks like the problem is more widespread than I imagined. Who do we confront with it, who has clout, or are going they to be like our politicians, blow hot air and do absolutely nowt!


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 Post subject: Re: HIDDEN HIDES
PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2013 10:37 pm 
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Location: Tetney Marshes or Idle Valley Notts.
Colin Smale wrote:
Hide design also needs updating to take into consideration today's big lenses. A lens hood for the Canon 500f4 is 6.5 inches in diameter, it doesn't fit through the slot of some hides <snip>


Just don't poke it through the slot Colin, then the guy sat next to you will be able to see a bit more than a long intrusive camera lens. ;o)

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 Post subject: Re: HIDDEN HIDES
PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 9:38 pm 
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Location: Barton-upon-Humber
police, ha ha ha ha ha. You may speak to a telephonist who could arrange a visit in the distant future at their convenience. I don't even consider the cops any more.


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 Post subject: Re: HIDDEN HIDES
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 12:35 am 
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Location: Tetney Marshes or Idle Valley Notts.
Andy Sharp wrote:
police, ha ha ha ha ha. You may speak to a telephonist who could arrange a visit in the distant future at their convenience. I don't even consider the cops any more.


Not meant as a criticism Andy but it's a sad state of affairs when the police are held in such low regard. :(

I do know what you mean and understand your frustrations regarding talking to a telephonist instead of an officer. It's bloody frustrating when the control room operator who is usually not a police officer asks you a million questions, like do you live local, what's your name, address, post code, contact telephone, oh and your home number in case and always before bothering to ask 'WHY' you called.
20 minutes later after supplying all the info. she/he asks if you are staying on site before depressing you further by stating, "I'm sorry but there is no officer available at present but we will send someone ASAP" If possible. As usual no one turns up, yet again! So why bother? If you give in Andy the yobs win again.

We had similar issues some 10 years ago at Lound (Idle Valley NR) Notts. with vandalism, fly tipping and plagued by Off-roaders and with similar responses from the police. More often than not "to busy" shall we say, to attend.

So I wrote a letter of Complaint to Nottinghamshire's Chief of Police and sent a copy to my MP.
Regarding what we perceived as a lack of interest from the local police force but at the same time offering help from myself and other locals birders to provide the police with information, names, dates times car numbers etc. to assist in eradicating this antisocial behaviour.

The chief of police duly responded and welcomed our offer of assistance by erecting lots of warning signs around the area to inform the yobs.
That 'Remote CCTV' was now in use.
Off-road Police are operating in the area
and that they would be prosecuted.

Don't know what our Chief of police said to the local sergeant but he called me and promised and dilivered the off-road team who visited Lound regularly on different days after that.
The local beat bobby and police cars patrolled the main lanes daily and we (local birders) watched everyone that visited like a hawk. Working together and with the police really made a difference.

Last year at Tetney I was involved in an incident with an irresponsible dog walker, followed by the telephonist problem you spoke of. I wrote to Humberside Police & Crime Commissioner and he sorted it by contacting the Chief of Police.

Mr.Matthew Grove is your 'Police & Crime Commissioner'.
He has to reply to a letter of complaint. No doubt he will pass it onto the Chief of Police to deal with, as it's an operational matter but at least it will get dealt with.

Matthew Grove
Office of Police & Crime Commissioner
Pacific Exchange
40 High Street
Hull
HU1 1PS

http://www.humberside-pcc.gov.uk/Contac ... olice.aspx

----------------------------------------------------
Barton Area Police:
Chief Superintendent Tony Forbes
Commander for B Division
Humberside Police Headquarters
Priory Police Station
Priory Road
Hull
HU5 5SF

http://www.humberside.police.uk/divisio ... ams/barton

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Del.


To err is human. To really louse things up takes a computer


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 Post subject: Re: HIDDEN HIDES
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 1:43 pm 
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Location: Cleethorpes
Just a couple of points about the knocking of the Police. It used to be the case that if your were calling from a mobile phone the 999 system wasn't able to know which force you were calling and so your call was dealt with differently than if you were calling on your home landline. I don't know if that is still the case but certainly is a good reason for the questions. I called the police on my mobile a few years ago about a road accident in Grimsby but because the call was taken by a non-Humberside telephonist the police vehicle was searching Hull for the accident rather than Grimsby. This was due to not enough details being taken. You also have to take into account all the crank and hoax calls they get every single day and have to sort the genuine ones out.

I witnessed a serious assault a week or 2 and there were 4 or 5 Police units on the scene and apprehending the culprits within 10 minutes. Now i don't know about you but as unpleasant it is for a reserve / hide to be damaged i would rather have the scare police resources involved in dealing with assaults, robberies, road accidents etc than vandalism.

We as home, vehicle and business owners have to take our own measure to protect our property in the shape of locks, alarms, cctv, guards etc so surely some of the responsibility is on reserves to do more themselves rather than relying on the police. I suspect that it is very very very infrequent that a Police officer or PCSO patrols past my house but i'm not compalining.

I know many will disagree with this post but it's my opinion.

James


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 Post subject: Re: HIDDEN HIDES
PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 1:00 pm 
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Location: Tetney Marshes or Idle Valley Notts.
I wasn't knocking the police James and I can't see anything to disagree with in your mail.

Your right James assaults, theft etc. should have priority but we are discussing criminal damage here so it should have been dealt with at some point.

Calling police on mobiles is easy now. As you get a list of nearest forces to you to choose from which I find works well.

Your right to point out that owners have responsibilities also. Not only to manage the reserve but any irresponsible behavior from its visitors.

May I ask who manages the 'Hidden Hide' reserve and also what if anything have they been doing about the problems?

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 Post subject: Re: HIDDEN HIDES
PostPosted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 4:33 pm 
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Sorry I have come to this thread a bit late, but couldn't resist just pointing out some LWT stats.

The Trust has 46 hides at the moment, with a replacement cost in excess of £250,000. They are, as noted, prime targets for the mischief-makers, with an annual replacement/repair/maintenance/cleaning bill in excess of £5,000. It's soul destroying for staff and volunteers coping with a constant abuse of these facilities. We have also tried every possible ergonomic combination of seat height to slot ratio, foot rests, bench width, slot size, to have glass or leave open etc. We have even sent people round to the North Norfolk coast measuring all the bird hides we could find, to try and come up with some avearge ratios. Harvey's Hide at Gib should represent the ultimate in hide ergonomics. You have to remember we have some very big birders (Hi Dean!) as well as little ones.

The provision of basic infrastructure, currently 96 hand gates, 33 kissing gates, 23 stiles and 241 field gates + padlocks represents nearly £100,000 of access investment. Added to that are the 63 benches and 42 bridges which come in a multitude of designs and materials, all of which need regular checking and maintenance.

The visitor routes for all LWT nature reserves currently add up to 71 miles of managed access. We have over £180,000 invested in machinery to help keep the paths open. Running costs for the trucks, fuel and servicing for access work costs over £25,000 a year. For the most part visitor routes do allow us to direct people where we want, reducing disturbance, predominantly to bigger mammals and birds, although plant trampling can be a real problem on some sites. It's mainly natural history "enthusiasts" that won't stick to the paths that cause the biggest problems.

Signage is also surprisingly expensive and high maintenance across the reserves. 121 entrance signs alone have cost the best part of £5K. These signs are beset with vandalism issues, with a constant drip-feed of replacements required. Interpreative panels have racked up another £30,000 over the last few years.

Including buildings, facilities, major path projects and all other access provision, LWT have been involved in about £5,000,000 of "people investment" this century.

As I have mentioned ad nauseum on this Forum, I have 12 staff covering 99 reserves (3,500 hectares), with a dwindling but dedicated team of reserve volunteers. You can only imagine how frustrating it is to see yet more grizzling about a restricted view from a hide! Why don't the "moaners" come forth and offer their services to help manage/clean the hides rather than expect everything to be sorted for them? Are we going to be expected to offer tripod portering services next, because your Manfrotto/Swarovski/Canon combo is getting too heavy for you to lug to the nearest hide? :D

So have a good bank holiday weekend, appreciate and enjoy the Trust's reserves if you are visiting them. Let us know (gently) if there is a problem and then if you can, offer your services to help us sort it out. Many hands make light work. I will go and trim the reeds in front of the hide at Kirkby Moor this very evening, but bare in mind if you are visiting that reserve, there is a wasps nest in the corner of the hide, so make sure the side flap stays open whilst you are in there! They don't seem to mind a bit of company as long as you sit still.

If life is all getting a bit too much, just go and sit on top of Quarry Hill at Rimac (Saltleetby NNR) and take in the view. Works for me!
Enjoy your birding and enjoy the great Lincolnshire countryside.
All the best
Dave
(Dave Bromwich, Head of Nature Reserves, LWT)


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 Post subject: Re: HIDDEN HIDES
PostPosted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 5:40 pm 
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Well stated, Dave. Of course there are quite a few of us who seldom enjoy such luxuries as a hide.


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 Post subject: Re: HIDDEN HIDES
PostPosted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 7:10 pm 
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Re: why dont moaners come forth & offer services...well in reply..services & suggestions were offered but rejected forthwith..health & safety kicked in as i said in my earlier post..


Last edited by Andy Atkinson on Fri Aug 23, 2013 8:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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